Aristotle and Dante Dive into the Waters of the World

Maybe it was because I listened to this book rather than read it and that makes the teenage affect much heavier, or maybe Lin Manuel-Miranda's voice reading teen boys in love broke my suspension of disbelief, but this book's writing felt heavy on the cheese and sentimentality and light on plot. I don't remember feeling that way about the initial book, which I really loved. The sequel has its moments – the author has a poetic style that frequently resolves in great lines, the incorporation of the AIDS pandemic and the stakes of queerness in this world being high, and the characterization of the parents especially is multilayered. (It's rare to get a YA book where parents are people too, and even good people central to the book.) Often I felt like this book walked in circles; I felt unconvinced at certain plot points.

Other reviews have correctly pointed out that the plot point of transphobia in the first book was not resolved or addressed in the second. In hindsight there's no reason why Ari's brother's crime had to use a trans woman as a victim when the books do not deal with broader trans representation or issues in any way.

Não tenho muitos motivos objetivos pra explicar minha decepção, só que o primeiro livro me tocou muito e esse me pareceu mais... genérico?
O primeiro ato parece correr pra transformar o setup do fim do primeiro livro num drama adolescente qualquer de um grupo de amigos na escola. A prosa também é desnecessária e inexplicavelmente repetitiva em alguns momentos, tanto em temática quanto em texto.
Ainda assim, gosto da psique de Ari e ser acompanhado por ele mais um tempo foi bom. O ponto de virada do último terço também deixou a história mais intimista de um jeito que me agradou, e ter esquecido dele por um mês também ajudou a voltar mais fresco pra história.
Enfim, 3 estrelas, difícil explicar.

Je ne pensais pas forcément qu'une suite à Aristote et Dante était nécessaire et en même temps j'avais vraiment envie de les retrouver. Ce second tome est extrêmement beau et touchant, on vit une vraie évolution des personnages, de leur entourage et de leur vie. J'ai rigolé, j'ai versé beaucoup de larmes, j'ai voulu les serrer fort contre moi, je ne vois pas quoi demander de plus d'un livre ❤️

This was...odd, I guess I could say. To be honest, this book feels like The Aristotle and Dante story, the first book, Aristotle and Dante Discover the Secrets of the Universe, being simply the prequel.

Where I did not enjoy the first book, in terms of plot, I loved this one. The first book felt like a lot of Aristotle just moping around and being grumpy and miserable, which made me feel grumpy and miserable reading it. However, in this book, Aristotle manages to come to terms with his brother's prison sentence, and his new found sexuality with the support of his parents, Dante, and his parents.

I do love how much Dante and Aristotle love their parents and how much they come to appreciate them, which makes the death of Aristotle's father that much more tragic. Although, I do find it a bit strange that the blurb of the book advertises this dramatic and unexpected death as the main plot of the book, when it actually happens about 3/4 the way through the book? I found this a bit odd.

But I love how this book is about Aristotle and Dante just being in love. It's heartwarming to see them together after the difficulty of the first book, despite the theme of the threat of AIDS.

However, there were a few things that keep this from being 4 or even 5 stars. First of all, is the fact that this book does feel like The Story. It makes the first book feel even worse, as I know that the story can be so much better and more enjoyable, but it isn't and that bothers me.
Second, is the odd debate Aristotle has with Cassandra about sexism and how it's presented. Cassandra seems to be presented as the annoying stereotype of the extreme feminist. I get that it's the 80's and views on women were more sexist, but I don't like how Cassandra's ideas about the patriarchy and the way society takes advantage of women are presented as being over the top and extreme. Cassandra's perspective as a woman who experiences sexism and is frustrated by it should not be seen as annoying or anything negative. The points that Cassandra brings up are all valid! And what really, really annoys me, is that it's turned into a debate, with a winner. And Aristotle wins...because he's gay? Does Benjamin Alire Sáenz not know that being gay and being sexist are not mutually exclusive? It's really annoying to see Aristotle shut down Cassandra's arguments by playing the gay card, which isn't even relevant to what she's saying, but is still presented like homophobia is equal to sexism. Both are just as bad as each other, but, again, are not mutually exclusive and not the same, therefore one cannot be used as an argument against the other.

Finally, there's the issue around Bernardo and the woman he killed. I am happy to say that this book handled her transness quite well. Apart from a few lines such as Aristotle calling her ‘he' when saying ‘he' fooled you when talking to Bernardo, although I understand that this instance, the misgendering is used ironically, and not meant harmfully (even though it always is). The second instant that makes me a bit uncomfortable is where Aristotle asks his mother if she knew the trans woman's name and her mother replies with ‘yes' but then says her birthname. Sure, some people do love and keep their birthname as their own, but the majority do not, and as the woman was dead, they couldn't ask her so it would be logical to assume she would've changed her name, especially from a clearly male name like Solitario. Also, if you know a person's birthname, then say ‘I know her birthname' which shows that you know that her birthname likely did not match with her actual name. Sorry to have such a big rant about, like, two lines, but as a trans person, those particular lines made me feel uncomfortable.
I do like how, as he did not know her name, Aristotle gave the trans woman a name, Camila, in a lovely letter that he gave to her grave. That made me smile.

I did like this book, despite its problems and I would recommend that if you enjoyed the first book, then you should read this one! And, even if you didn't enjoy the first one, I would still recommend it, as the tone of the book is a lot different and more positive than the first.

Especially in the beginning, this book felt a little choppy and cliche in parts. However, throughout the book, Saenz writes with the same deep love for his characters, charm, and realism seen in the first book about Dante and Aristotle. I loved watching Ari grow, mature, and deal with hardships. The characters are so loveable. But the ending felt a bit rushed.

i liked this book. i didn't like it as much as the first one, but it was still beautiful in discovering what love and friendship meant and how those two things are inherently intertwined. i liked the exploration of loss and grief and isolation, and how we feel as though we will never belong. CONS: someone once said that the conversations were unrealistic, and now i cannot unsee that. is it so hard to have an informal conversation? also, i almost felt as if there was bi-erasure in this book; i feel like ari was meant to be bisexual. now i know gay men can describe/love women without romantically loving women, but here's my quota: ari was sexually attracted to men and romantically attracted to women. i think the way he described people like mrs q and cassandra, he described them in a way where it made it seem like he had a crush on them. he 100% mrs q was a milf???? like ok, i get it, gay men

The character development and interpersonal relationships were just as beautiful as the first book, if not even more so, but the prose felt very rambly and at times almost unedited. A few of the same points were made repeatedly throughout the book in almost the same way, and nearly every paragraph felt like it was at least a sentence or two longer than it needed to be. If it had been edited down to be the closer to the same length as the first book, I think it could have been a solid five stars.

Still a beautiful read though. I am glad it exists.